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Keith,
If you have any reservations, cancel them. Your in great company with the Colorado Karting community.
I’ve been here since 1978, and have seen many come and go. But the bottom line is Karting in our state
has survived and is starting to show signs of strength once again and if history repeats itself ???Your interest is valued, any questions please ask…..
Ron Rudolph.
I have been hesitant about chiming in on this topic. Spent to much time and too many years working for the solution.
Don’t know how to insert the exact thread but if someone would get into the EKN forums back in 2002 I believe you will find an
interesting discussion under “Mountain Region Problems”.And out of those threads was born this.
http://ekartingnews.com/news_info.php?n=1369
http://ekartingnews.com/news_info.php?n=1563
And it ended with this.
@R Rudolph wrote:
Keith,
If you have any reservations, cancel them. Your in great company with the Colorado Karting community.
I’ve been here since 1978, and have seen many come and go. But the bottom line is Karting in our state
has survived and is starting to show signs of strength once again and if history repeats itself ???Your interest is valued, any questions please ask…..
Ron Rudolph.
So here is how i thought it would go next season if i decided to dump $$ into this sport, which btw… at least on the rentals – even though they are super slow – i have had much enjoyment out of.
Buy kart, used/new whatever. Though probably used to keep costs down. Buy 3-4 sets of tires – run several hundred laps to get up to speed so i am not a moving chicane. Goto first race and hope to finish Last +1! 😆
So now we are at hmm.. 3-6k for the kart + what, 6-800ish for just practice tires plus gas plus track rental time. plus anything that breaks plus helmet, suit, rib protector blah blah all the stuff needed before i even turn a wheel Ok. Not super expensive, but still a considerable amount of $.
I even went down to Billet Performance to talk to them to see whats up cost wise etc.
Then i come here read these threads which basically amount to: Colorado Karting is broken. Lack of cooperation between track owners, disgruntled racers that have quit, whatever the reason etc etc.
The latest one from:
@Curt Kistler wrote:
Karting in Colorado always finds it way through new seasons. Change is good, and it needs to be embraced by everyone moving forward. I am sure the karting community will find ways to fix the problems for low turn outs, but until the track owners find ways to mend their indifferences, there will continue to be a division that makes for these low turn outs.
Now I do not know any of the back story, just what is posted – that is all i have to go on. But it does give me pause. Hell I could goto unser every week on their BOGO days and buy 14 min of track time for every week for about 1k/yr. Plus sprinkle a few trips to TTAC (though it is a shame their is no timing there for rentals) and/or bandimere during the summer for a lot less $ outlay. And still spend much less $.
So it basically comes down to, i will gladly (spend the $$ for more fun and to actually race people – even if i finish last ! Now i don’t really expect fields of 20, But if its just me a 2 other people.. what’s the point?
A shame i missed the last race at TTAC to see what is up, life got in the way.
I suppose i have about 5 months before i have to make a choice, But maybe i’m overthinking this, who knows.
Hello, Keith:
It seems you may have gotten the wrong impression, from many of us and myself included.
I am not currently racing for reasons of funds mainly, but do not think I would hesitate based on what you’ve read here. Yes, the has been some divisions going on, and without those it would be stronger — and without speaking for others, it seems that’s what we’re all saying.
But I also believe the Glory Days are just ahead. Some here recall what it was like a few years back in its finest hours, and they miss it and want it back. But if you have the urge to race karts — and if there’s one thing I can speak for everyone it’s that we all love it because it’s a BLAST and thus there’s some impassioned anger here — then I would recommend you carry on and do it.
If your Jonesing to do this because of a love for motor sport, competition, camaraderie, and perhaps most importantly to make and enjoy a lifetime of friends, I highly doubt you will regret kart racing. I’ve done it off and on for 35 years and must have 30 enduring friendships from karting alone, and have absolutely no regrets for a single nickel spent.
When my mind wanders to my life’s greatest memories, many are invariably from the kart tracks and people I’ve so enjoyed.
[Edit: I can add that there’s many, many people around here, myself included, that welcome new racers and are willing and able to offer advice to help you get going in the right direction. Use Us.]
Keith, if you have the discretionary $$$ and are willing to spend some time researching and waiting for an appropriate kart package to come up for sale, I say get a kart and go test & tune with it as much as you can while we have a choice of great tracks to drive on. You can drive rentals until you’re certifiably insane for less money, but it’s not going to be the same kick as a TaG or shifter.
Okay, I haven’t actually had my kart out in 1.5 years because my first loves (wife, 3 kids, and yes, my bicycle) have come first. However, I’ve benefited immensely from just tearing the kart down, rebuilding it, and driving when I can, and I don’t regret the investment for a second. Racing? Maybe someday, but for your situation I’d say you ain’t gonna race if you DON’T have a kart.
Hey thanks for those replies. It seems as if I might have read too much into the negativity.
If all goes well perhaps I’ll see some of you next season.
Thanks Doug for some very good memories.
All this does is make me a little bummed that we can’t set aside egos and do what’s best for all. RACE AT EACH AND EVERY TRACK HERE IN COLORADO.
Involve Kutcher and SKUSA gang, I don’t care. Let’s all race with bigger fields. Like they just did at the Nats….I’m just sayin…
@Mike Jansen wrote:
Thanks Doug for some very good memories.
All this does is make me a little bummed that we can’t set aside egos and do what’s best for all. RACE AT EACH AND EVERY TRACK HERE IN COLORADO.
Involve Kutcher and SKUSA gang, I don’t care. Let’s all race with bigger fields. Like they just did at the Nats….
I’m just sayin…That’s what I have been sayin, and don’t make me do it, but I have every track owner in CO sayin it on record at one point in time over the past 5 years as well. Not one stock moto blew up in Vegas all week. The TaG’s all ran great, and even the future of karting “Cadet” class was the best racing to watch this weekend too.
It’s a very simple, cost effective, manageable, quick and proven fix to many of kartings problems. But what do we know Mikey? Hope you all figure it out soon, or keep looking for those small events with lot’s of classes for everyone. :peaceLets not forget that in the great old days, there were NO outside influences, it was just us. I sat down with at the time with 3 track owners, JB, Brad and Stacey and we got it done. Jim joined later once his track opened but we could never get our friend in the Springs to come on board. Later, everyone got sideways and it ended but for a while, we were considered to be THE regional series that was the future of karting. It was an example of how groups of karters could get together and make things happen.
It can happen again. But for it to happen, we have to drop the various sanctioning bodies and go our own way. Rotax is strong in Colorado, you can’t deny it. Shifters are weak, that’s a fact. And anyone who knows me knows I love shifters. We won the SKUSA SuperNats long before most of you even knew what they were. I helped write the rules and made some of the gages that are currently used in Stock Moto. So are you going to build from that or are you going to continue to dig in your heels and say our system is the only way. As long as you guys continue with that line of thinking, I hope you enjoy having only 20 to 30 racers at your events.
If you want to make it happen in Colorado, here’s what you should do. SKUSA for all shifter classes, Rotax for all tag classes, drop the idea of TAG altogether including SKUSA’s version of cadet. While your at it, get rid of the 4 cycles. They belong on lawn mowers and tillers. The flat heads almost fit but the OHV engines are too wide and too heavy for a go kart. If you did that you stand a chance of having big fields again.
If you don’t do as I suggest, next year you will be having the same conversation.
@Doug Welch wrote:
… If you want to make it happen in Colorado, here’s what you should do. SKUSA for all shifter classes, Rotax for all tag classes, drop the idea of TAG altogether including SKUSA’s version of cadet. While your at it, get rid of the 4 cycles. They belong on lawn mowers and tillers. The flat heads almost fit but the OHV engines are too wide and too heavy for a go kart. If you did that you stand a chance of having big fields again.
If you don’t do as I suggest, next year you will be having the same conversation.
With all due respect, you may well be proven right… but this approach seems to slight the resolutive thinking that’s needed for the good of all players. Despite my being on the outside looking in, but having interest in coming back in, I too care what happens in moving forward. Your closing comment seems just a bit “my way or the highway,” and that’s an approach that’s been part of the problem in some local tensions already.
Perhaps I’m misreading here, Doug… but the idea that Brad should scrap several hundred Grand over 10 years of investment in bringing 4-strokes into the States — not to mention racers who’ve spent good money on such motors — is pretty divisive. These 4-stroke motors were purpose-built for karting, and your “lawnmower” comment forgets that Shifter motors were not built for karting, but for motorcycles. Who Cares in either case?
What’s good for everybody is the path to follow, and equipment scrapping isn’t viable for many. And one person’s projected solution is almost never the sole answer.
Just in my humble opinion, however.
I tend to agree somewhat with Erics thoughts. It is hard for many of us in karting to keep reinvesting in engines and equipment every few years just because some orginization thinks there “NEW” engine is the wave of the future. I have taken my son to many of the tracks over the last couple years to race. What I see is that the 2 groups with the largest turnouts on a consistent basis is TTAC with the Rotax series and the CJKC IKF kids program and their Briggs 4 stroke package. If some sort of state series with larger turnouts is to come about these are the 2 groups that will need to be brought together as a starting point along with the shifters possibly as someone said under the SKUSA rules. If all involved parties would sit down with open non confrontational discussions this could happen. I think this year in California the IKF Region 7 and the Gatorz Rotax series ran a joint schedule. I beliver the same thing will be tried with the IKF Region 11 and NorCal Rotax series next year. So if people just sit down and havesome open lines of communication on this it can happen. To me it seems so simple. If our true love is the sport of karting as we all keep saying then lets do what is best for all the karters in Colorado.
Let’s be straight forward here guys when TTAC and IMI had the falling out it killed colorado racing. We need to get back to the mentality of what the racers want because really we don’t race for the money and those on a tight budget can’t buy a new engine every year to support the changing programs. If we want the big numbers back here’s what needs to happen. The tracks and series need to work together, Period. Until it happens we’re screwed.
Simple fix:
Go back to mixing TAG and Rotax. With one exception, the TAG classes need to run Mojo’s. Rotax guys get to qualify and get to compete on an even level at the club level. Oh and didn’t CRE fail because it was a Rotax only track and car count sucked.Shifters- These classes are fueled by the TAG classes so until we get those number up the shifter count will stay down.
TAG=entry level/ smaller budget
Shifter=experienced drivers looking for more of a challenge/ bigger parts wear/higher speeds/ bigger budgetIf a guys who has only been in the sport for a few years can see the problems why can’t those in charge. And by the way series operators, running a regional program at one track with one special event at a different location basicly makes your series a club series with a larger cost.
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