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When a race is called a rain race, the competitor most of the time has a choice in using slicks or rain tires depending on their own forecast of their race. In areas that have lots of rain I could see a ruling for a spec rain tire just like a spec racing slick. But here I agree, no need to muddy the water when it hardly ever happens anyway.
I also don’t see the need to say that grooved slicks aren’t allowed, as the racer can all ready choose to run a regular slick tire in a rain race if they feel that the track will be drying during their race.
If we are allowing any rain tire as the norm for the rules, and assuming I am right with a racer can choose to run slicks or treads, give me one reason a groved slick would be bad to allow?How good do the Mycrons and Digitrons hold up in the rain?
Not so fast frosty, I have been at rain races where once it was declared rain, we all had to go out on rains. One time up in Oh Canada, they called it rain, we all switched to rains. By the time they got around to getting us out on track, it quit, the track dried and we burned up a $185 set of rains for nothing. At all the events I’ve been to, if the race director declares it wet, you have to switch to wets or you don’t get to play.
Thanks Shocky, I didn’t know what SKUSA rules had in store for us.
You seem proud of your race directors poor judgement.
I can say that all the rain races I have been to or watched has always left the tire choice up to the race team. F1/SCCA/ and all street races that I attended in the past. We almost saw it in Mexico Cities Bush race last weekend too.
Sounds like the race director in Canada messed up. Would it not be better to let the ones paying to play, choose to make their own mistakes?I know that Rock Island held some rain races last year. Was there a transition period with karts on the track with rains and slicks?
Your right Rodney, in cars, it’s usually up to the team and driver slicks or wets. But in karts, at all the SKUSA events I’ve been to, if its declared wet, you have to run rains. They usually give you 20 minutes to change and as you know, that can be a life time around here when it come to weather changes!
That’s why I think that as much as I wish we get the chance to run in the rain, I think the chances are very slim.
Decided to look it up in the rulebook… this is what I found. Guess we should start quizzing you guys on the rules!
20.2.6.5 Rain tires:
20.2.6.5.1 SKUSA races rain or shine.
20.2.6.5.2 Tires must be manufactured rain tires; No
grooved slicks are allowed.
20.2.6.5.3 The decision to declare a race a rain race is at the
discretion of the Race Director.
20.2.6.5.4 When rain conditions are declared for a race, it is
at the racers discretion to choose rains or slicks. Rain tires
are only optional to use when it has been declared a rain
race. The number of sets will be at the Race Directors
discretion.@Angie MacEwen wrote:
20.2.6.5.4 When rain conditions are declared for a race, it is
at the racers discretion to choose rains or slicks. Rain tires
are only optional to use when it has been declared a rain
race. The number of sets will be at the Race Directors
discretion.I wish that had been in place 3 years ago. It would have prevented a hugh argument. (I was just a spectator to that one.)
Gee whizz, I was correct for once.
Now back to my question, sence there is not going to be a spec’ed rain tire, and the racer can choose between slicks or rain tires, give me one good reason for not allowing grooved slicks?
I don’t really care one way or the other, my only point is that we seem to embrace every word of someone elses rules with out questioning the reasons for them. I want to thank everyone that is working to customize our rules to fit our needs. Monkey see, monkey do, doesn’t fit the racers needs all the time.
I could live with no grooved slicks, just as long as I don’t see any shaved treaded “rain” tires.
Sence we are talking tire rules, what are the rules and enforcement of tire cutting/ interior and exterior tire dopeing/ Tire pre heating/ heat or chemical cleaning?I have only raced in the rain once, it was Rock Island and was a total downpour, it was one of the funnest races ever… I do however agree that we should be really cautious with the kids…. We will have MG rains on hand for our events if anyone needs them..
Freezeman,
Those are good questions. While no grooved tires has been a long time rule and I wasn’t involved to know the intent. I believe I can make some educated assumptions.
The biggest reason for no grooving of slicks is safety. If anyone has seen the cross section of a slick race tire, its very thin. It would be very easy to compromise the housing with a stray grooving hand.
AS far as letting the decision being up to the racer several things come to mind. There are rare occasions where its hard to decide between full wets and full drys. I saw a race at Putnam park once where everyone started on rains save a few guys. The guys on wets stepped out for about 20 minutes. The track dried out and some cat on Drys started reeling the lead group. He eventually passed and left the lead pack all by himself with the dry tires on.
Also, reality comes into play. Is a guy really going to attempt to race on a soaked obvious wet tire track with slicks? I like to give racers more credit and think they can make a decision on that set up choice with out having to be told. And like all other set ups if it turns out to be the way to go, well I guess he deserves to do well. All the other racers can only cuss themselves for not being as “smart”.As far as tire doping. Its the fall back rule of “If it doesn’t say you can, you can’t”. Obviously, catching it and enforcing it has its own problems. But, there are rules in place to disallow it. As far as trimming rain slicks down. That would gain no benefit. In a situation of a track getting dry you need all the rubber you can get because a dry track will eat rains for lunch. And if the tracks wet, the tires have grooves for a reason, water channeling, trimming them down would decrease water displacement. So the nature of the negatives for doing it such a thing self polices itself.
It really shouldn’t be a big deal. The biggest issue is whether a spec tire is used. Thats dealt with. Otherwise, if its dry run MG yellows. If it rains run rain tires. There are rare moments when going out on slicks at a beginning of a wet race may be the way to go. But, no one should lose sleep. Its usually pretty obvious and racers can make that decision themselves.
Of course, it always gets good when the top guys roll up without tires and have wets and drys ready. And the stare down starts. Whos doing what. lol
Thanks,
Todd BellewFreezeman, Everyone wanted printed rules this year and now we have them. We gotta start somewhere. Rules have been available now for a couple of weeks and the suggestions made to modify them have ran the gamut. What was the purpose of adopting a set of rules if we are going to wind up with an addendum to the rules that is bigger than the rule book itself? Some of the exceptions suggested have been so petty it was laughable. I am not in favor of going “lock step” with whoevers’ rules we have adopted but could we at least get in to the season before we try and reinvent the wheel.
The rules say no grooved slicks!Rusty
Rod, The biggest reason to adopt and follow a clear set of simple, cut and dry, no B.S. rules is as follows: people MOST OFTEN make the already giant investment because they want to RACE (drive)! Basic tuning and driving well enough to win, as you know, are already mind twisting tasks. If you care about the growth of our great sport, you won’t ask every guy out there to be a machinist, toolmaker, tire engineer, chemist, meteorologist, and forever so forth. I absolutely believe that YOU, could competently groove your own tires. Are you sure all your neighbors could? :bs: You already have every skill, times 3, to win within’ these simple and commonly understandable rules. Use the system to your advantage. Get a set of rains, peel off the wrapper on race day, and go out and kick tail. You know you would. Jooiinnn uusss … JOOInnn uuusss. :rotate: :rotate: :rotate:
Grate dicussion!
One reason I am bring up tire preping is because I have been seeing several different attempts at doing just that in the pits over the last couple of years.
Open flame in the pits, I think is a no no?
I even wonder if it is legal to clean your tires between heats with a heat gun, like I see many others doing, including myself.
Then the plastic jugs daping on “oh it’s just a cleaner” with kids standing by to help out with the cancer causing tire prep.
If heat guns are allowed can I use a heat box, or heating plankets?
It’s not that I want to, it’s more of, If I don’t, somebody else might do it and bet me with things that I am all ready capable of doing.Todd, Thanks for your feed back. Just one comment though.
“As far as trimming rain slicks down. That would gain no benefit. In a situation of a track getting dry you need all the rubber you can get because a dry track will eat rains for lunch. “
A dry track may eat rain tires for lunch, but I think an intermediate track would work quite well with cut treaded tires. I think the rules say any treaded tire, there are harder treaded tires available other than just rain tires. That is why I put Rain tires in “……”
Again,no big deal, I just enjoy good discusions.Hay, I dug threw my tire pile found these MG yellow tires but some of them have SL written on them. Do they still make MG yellow SL tires?
Rod, Weather has been awesome. Sure its wintery for an hour or two a week, but, other than some wind, the track beckons you. Get down here and get that thing tuned up. They’ll let you wear an X in the PRO shifter class. :rotate:
Rod, You and I need to talk. You got so many little ideas running around it that fuzzy little head that you need to share with me. You are pointing out some stuff that I never would have caught at first or second glance. 😳
When does class start? 😆 😆AHH, come on now, My Rodology doesn’t have enough class to race Pro.
Unless of coarse someone out there wanted to add me along with some tech support, pit help and just a couple of them ICC things.
How do you hook up these moto motors to a flow bench?
Do you guys do leakdown tests on Reeds?
Why don’t you 2 cycle guys run on meth instaed of gas?
I am loading up and heading down to IMI today.Rusty I am just a big kid that never stopped asking “Why”.
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