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@FTK51 wrote:
Oh boy, we woke up the sleeping giant……
One minor point that you may be missing Jeremy, is that the track was not open for open testing those days, unless the teams paid to rent it out. I thought that I made that clear, but apparently it was lost in my elegant post.
There was no $40 option, because the track wasn’t interested in offering it. It was closed to open practice.
The only way that people were able to practice is if the teams stepped up and paid the $5K per day. At $40 per driver, they would have lost about $4K each day. That would have been pretty charitable of them. They found enough drivers willing to pay the fees to make it work.
They did so and simply expected to be reimbursed for their investment. Greedy bastards.
Next, Rotax karts aren’t $20K.
Finally, congratulations on your championship.
Andy
I would like to ask a question regarding this. You say the track was closed. You said in a previous post that rental karts make more money for tracks than holding a race. So why the hell was the track closed? It is a business correct? Who was paying for it to be closed? Any business person would want that place open if it can be opened. You said there are rules about practice at a track 1 week before a race. That sounds like Rotax pays the track to not open for those days. So, who pays for Rotax to pay the track? Oh, would that be the consumer? Also how much is a competitive National level kart? Can I get there and win a race (as long as I can drive) for 6k? I see you are a dealer so you should be able to answer these questions for me really quickly. Like I said, I have been told it is a lot more so that is why I haven’t gotten into it yet. But if I can get in to a rotax for 6k then I just might. This 6k came about as this is the exact price for my kart plus the national event I am already going for 206 (Brand new equipment), plus room and extra parts and support items. Can I do that with a Rotax, if not how much would it be? 10, 15, 20?
Rolling chassis will be about the same $s for either TaG or LO206. New engine that has been blue printed will be close to $5k for Rotax. Then you have to buy the tires each race for $250. Fuel $75 and oil at $20 a weekend. National event like US Open Supernationals, I think has an entry of around $800-900 but includes tires and fuel. Gets pretty expensive, but not much else can be raced for this cheap. There is a reason that Sonoma had 100 LO206 entries last week though.
Ok kid you win…..I’m not here to argue with you but I will leave you with this. I have seen the inside of winning motors from different teams all across the country and I will tell you there isn’t much difference in any of them. I agree there are cylinders, coils, carbs that maybe a little better from one batch to another but a good motor in the hands of a great tuner/driver will beat a great motor in the hands of an average tuner/driver every time. But like many in racing that believe it’s all about the motor and drink the kool aide from motor builders that say you need this or that in order to win is false, I’m not saying it may not help but it’s certainly isn’t the missing piece in most cases, it’s the total package that will win.
The motors I have for sale are good, fresh, motors. All they would need is an EVO package and go racing. Horsepower wise I’m sure there very close but I’m sure you don’t believe that.
Signing off….
MikeWow, you all think I am stuck in my ways. Apparently, based on the text and outside comms I had the price too high. Richard was the first one to spell it out for me as I asked. Thank you Richard!
So, 2-3k for a chassis 5k for a good motor. Tires and fuel and parts we are looking closer to 10k instead of 20. Sorry I was told 20k somewhere and it stuck. I stand corrected on the amount.
In regards to the National event. Only 900 and that includes fuel, tires and oil that is a lot cheaper than what I was told. Last numbers someone gave me was like 4k for nationals.
See, I was just mistaken in how much it was cause I was told incorrectly. Instead of getting upset with me saying Rotax is too much a better reaction would have been like Richards actually giving me the exact information I was requesting. Those that said I was being negative could have provided the information Richard did.
No need to be butt hurt about saying lo206 is cheaper than Rotax. I mean math doesn’t lie 4k vs 10k. Granted my numbers were wrong above but this is just plain math. I bet this forum will help newbies decide which class to jump in as it has real numbers of ownership. Btw, I wasn’t looking to win the debate. More about getting correct information out there. If I am incorrect and get corrected I will state that. Which in this case I stand corrected but still 4k vs 10k from a math perspective Lo206 wins every time.
Edit: And I tried to ignore it but just couldn’t. Mike, I am not a kid. I am 31 years old and have done a lot in those 31 years. I would appreciate if you keep this civil and not call me something I am not. I will accept Dude, Man, Hey you, Jeremy, Davis, sir, or any other. But calling me a kid just sounds derogatory in this context. If it wasn’t meant that way I totally understand but if you were meaning it to be derogatory please, let’s keep this civil. We are both humans living in this place. Let’s show each other the respect we both deserve.
I have also heard that some of the Nationals, think SKUSA, do cost $3-4K to enter. Can’t confirm this though. Think for dealers, there is a higher profit margin with the TaG. Unfortunately a totally new setup is out of most people’s price range. The cost of running one is up there too. Here is what a lot are missing. The LO206 is not going to make dealers a lot of money off the bat. But, if it is promoted well, you can get a lot more people into it due to the low initial cost. This, in turn, gets more new karters involved and it will all balance out in the end. People also might want to get into TaG after running LO206. I know TaG was originally intended to be an inexpensive spec class, but it has now grown into a upper level class that costs a lot of $s to be competitve. That’s my $0.02 on the matter.
@Richard Gordon wrote:
I have also heard that some of the Nationals, think SKUSA, do cost $3-4K to enter. Can’t confirm this though. Think for dealers, there is a higher profit margin with the TaG. Unfortunately a totally new setup is out of most people’s price range. The cost of running one is up there too. Here is what a lot are missing. The LO206 is not going to make dealers a lot of money off the bat. But, if it is promoted well, you can get a lot more people into it due to the low initial cost. This, in turn, gets more new karters involved and it will all balance out in the end. People also might want to get into TaG after running LO206. I know TaG was originally intended to be an inexpensive spec class, but it has now grown into a upper level class that costs a lot of $s to be competitve. That’s my $0.02 on the matter.
My thoughts exactly! I actually want to race a Rotax. I ran one in the last race at The Track and it was a blast! The only reason I haven’t got one yet is price. Just can’t afford to buy a TaG when I am also buying a trailer and what not. Maybe next year now that I know the true cost. Not sure how I got the 20k stuck in my head. lol That is why I like Lo206 so much as it is quick to get into the sport and be competitive. Every race I have been in has had some great battles. And it is the battles I am looking for.
Each have their + and – but price is a big – that keeps a lot of people away. I wish they were to move back to the way it used to be. I hope Lo206 doesn’t turn into another Rotax. lol
Wow, the subject line really depicts this topic and I’m not talking about the track cost, that is totally understandable. Roger said it right, if you want to promote karting stop being so negative, and so confrontational. But this is a public forum and our only choice is to not engage…. Blah blah blah.
Gia
Shifters rule!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Even with a busted leg it costs money to race (actually with a busted leg it is extremely more money – this is from Gia).
Norbert
We actually think you are a decent guy, jet, but we can not figure out why you are so confrontational??
@Suicidecustoms wrote:
Wow, the subject line really depicts this topic and I’m not talking about the track cost, that is totally understandable. Roger said it right, if you want to promote karting stop being so negative, and so confrontational. But this is a public forum and our only choice is to not engage…. Blah blah blah.
Gia
Shifters rule!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Even with a busted leg it costs money to race (actually with a busted leg it is extremely more money – this is from Gia).
Norbert
We actually think you are a decent guy, jet, but we can not figure out why you are so confrontational??
Please point out to me where I am being negative Norbert. And my name is not Jet. It is Jeremy. 😉 Confrontational? I just stated facts about how Rotax was more expensive than a Lo206 (which is truth) and yet I get bashed for it. Then I stick up for myself and am called confrontational? What? I will ask again. Where was I confrontational or negative? 4k vs 10k (yes, I got the price wrong initially but was corrected and I stated that) is a difference.
The original post was about a team charging 250 for a test and tune for extra people. The team already has it open without that extra person so they already have it paid for. I was just saying this is BS to charge the guy just coming to the track for a test and tune day 250. Charge him the normal 40 and be done with it. Unless he is getting all the stuff the other team members get that pay dues to the team. In regards to Rotax all I was saying was the price was higher than Lo206 and that I can go to a National level event for a 1/4 of the price. That is when others bashed into me saying I was starting stuff and being negative. It is funny how it is all the people that make money in some way shape or form with Rotax. It might be negative for them but for the people selling Lo206 it might be a positive. I am just trying to get the facts out there. The original poster bitched about cost and so I brought more of the issue up and yet I get bashed for it.
I am not confrontational I just speak up when I see an issue or something that doesn’t seem fair to me. I remember you talking next to my pit spot about GJMS about how you spent money and didn’t get all that you want. Public place as well… So you can bitch in person but I can’t say something that is facts on a public forum? I apologize for getting the amount wrong of 20k vs 10k but still that is a lot!
Gia, you say you don’t want to engage but you are. Communication is all I am looking for on here and yet I get pointed out that I am confrontational or other bs. Why is that? Bring up money I guess is fighting words in this community. That is a bummer. lol Also I guess weights and tire choice are other Hot topics. lol All I am trying to do is get communication up but anything I bring up that goes against “the what we have done in the past” it gets bashed and the poster gets yelled at and called negative and confrontational and not a real racer. Or get called a kid or a really bad toned response from all those that make money from this sport. and more specifically Rotax. If they really want to grow the sport their response should have been telling me exactly what a Rotax costs and how much it really costs to go to a National level event instead of saying I was being negative and just stating I got it wrong. It took Richard to pitch in to explain the cost. I find it sad this happened. All I was doing was sharing my view point and I get bashed for it. I truly don’t understand.
Can we please answer my questions about where exactly I was negative and confrontational? I feel it was on the other side that was negative and confrontational. I was level headed and just stuck to the facts but I will re-read just to make sure I am not being negative. If I find something that seems negative I will let you know. But please point it out if you have an example. I would really like to fully understand what is so negative and confrontational about facts. And this is a legit question not a snide comment or anything like that. sometimes the way I ask questions or state things can come across as passive aggressive or something. That isn’t the intent, I guess I just write that way. lol Most of the time I don’t even know I do it. (this was added as an edit as I felt that last part wasn’t clear. 🙂 )
@Greg Welch wrote:
4k to enter any race? I’m pretty sure I’ve never seen an entry fee over $1,200. Ever.
Thank you Greg for actually providing the price to the national events. I was told it was in the 4k range. I must have been told incorrectly. Again, I was stating numbers that was told to me. Then people were saying I was wrong without giving me the correct prices. Thank you! I stand corrected in the entry price for a Rotax National event. This seems a lot lower than I originally was told/thought.
For those that got on my ass for saying the price was more and yet not giving me the correct price. ^ Here is a great concept. How about instead of bitching at me, how about we have a conversation like those that actually provided the actual prices for how much things are. It turns into a much easier conversation.
So 1200 entry fee. Does this include tires, fuel, and what not or is this just the entry into the race? I assume we have pit space fees and what not as well.
Most Rotax events are between $500 and $900 for the entry. Includes race tires, 5 gallons of fuel, oil, etc. That is for 4-5 days of racing so its really not too bad.
@Greg Welch wrote:
Most Rotax events are between $500 and $900 for the entry. Includes race tires, 5 gallons of fuel, oil, etc. That is for 4-5 days of racing so its really not too bad.
wow, that isn’t that bad. How the heck did we get 4k in our heads? lol Seems like we have a breakdown in communication. 🙁 I may want to re-look at going to a Rotax National event.
Could you give a breakdown as to how much it would be to run say in Vegas? I would want a mechanic and new equipment or equipment that has been proven to be fast and reliable. As I would have no clue what I am doing on the mechanic side of the house. lol I just want to race. What I am looking for is a full package deal that would get me to Vegas and would be up to my driving skills to get to the top. How much would that cost me? It seems that is what I am really looking for as I did this with the Lo206 and came out to be 15k total for the whole two series (CSC and CKT), new equipment, new trailer, National level event, travel for both series and Nationals, and anything else needed for racing. Turns out I need a better towing vehicle. lol
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