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As a racer in the same boat as Jim, I can vouich for what he is saying in its entirety. When we first bought our ICC it was at that time a 2003 TM K9 prepped by claudio valiente. We ran it a little rich from time to time and it was really cheap with that in perspective. We got it in january and ran it untill march when we went to Jacksonville. At that moment we changed top ends and ran a weekend in florida. That motor cost us practically nothing untill we started running it as a hand grenade, tuning it for max power, reving the crap out of it, running qualifying reeds, etc etc. And those motors are a bit touchy on the lower end, i lost a rod bearing in steamboat, probably too much time on it but whos to say anyway. The sanctioning bodys can make any motor last if they allow these things to be run relaible and not as time bombs. I look forward to the CSC in 05 when it becomes its own board
Same boat as Jim, I have had my ICC for 3 years.
I don’t get to race much due to my work schedule but I have a lot of test and tune days.Doug,
I would think that the racers in around here should be pleased that your boy?s are running the TAG class. Having a higher level of competition only improves the entire field.
I don?t consider TAG a novice class but it is an easy place for a new comer to start. I also had a TAG kart for a while and think the racing is fantastic. I am of the opinion that drivers coming out of direct drive or direct drive like karts are generally smoother and very fast as they move in to a shifter or on to cars.
Remember the karting world championship is in direct drive karts.
Points to ponder and go Hmmmmmmmmmmm………
Jim Keesling, when is THE TRACK actually going to be A TRACK?????? I know you got your city approval so where are you?????? I call it a hunch but there are a couple of people who would LOVE to drive another track.
TaG kart at full revs… and being called a rookie class? Direct drive (a kissing cousin of TaG) was where Kimi Raikkonen, Michael Schumacher, Ayrton Senna and Fernando Alonso finished before they went on to cars where you wear seat belts!
As with any engine, you run it as lean as possible and see what happens. Same when you rev it to 17,000 revs…
Bottom line for me, is that a stock shifter class will turn into another whomever has the $$$$$ will get the gold.
They are flat out too expensive, too much maintenance time. I did it for 3 yrs. Yes that was 3 yrs ago and things have changed but the urge to win is too great for the boys who have the money.
Another class a longer day-when do the class divisions stop.
they should run them with the other shifter class. If they are stock then the hot motors are going to blow by them anyway.
I pulled this off http://www.ekartingnews.com
from Mike Kellum
Just for kicks, I read and compared the NCK rules to SKUSAs rules. They are very similar but not exactly the same.
NCK allows:
– an additional .010 base gasket (to the stock gasket)
– drilling three 1/16″ oiling holes on exhaust bridge area of piston
– use of PWM carburetor
– Pumparound modification
– o-ringed aftermarket exhaust flange
– kickstarter hump removal (to be phased out)
– case clearancing for larger counter sprockets (understandable for road racing)
NCK requires:
– minimum silencer dimension of 3″x12″
– air boxes only when when mandatedThose sound like some pretty solid rules to me. What do you guys think? Which would you prefer: SKUSA or NCKs specs? I can see a benefit to both. I cna see that NCK is trying to entice people into the class by making it a cylinder, piston, head, and pipe swap (and possibly silencer). Whereas SKUSA is taking the purist’s approach which pretty much requires a new motor. I am curious to see how well the more pliable NCK rules work out.
What are the thoughts on which rule set to run here.
Also, could some of you long term guys help me understand the procedural steps we need to take to get this class going?
1) Agree on specs
2) Submits specs to?? (track owners/CSC board)
3) Vote on class? who?when?where?After this it is a little confusing. :idn:
It would be nice to know if this is going to happen, I personally would like the winter to build my kart and get some test and tune time, so I can come prepared to race. 😀
Sorry here is the link to the NCK class specs:
http://www.nckroadracing.com/2004_classes/nck-stock_cr125_moto_rules.html
Dan,
Nothing happens until the last week in January when IMI-club sector has their annual meeting to set IMI-club rules rules, division and specs. Noting has ever happend before then in the 6 yrs I have seen.
As far as CSC goes now I would not have a clue as the new paid directors would decide that.
As to running this class with the other shifters (novice/masters) there comes a point when too many karts on the track is compromising safety ~>18 karts.
Again I say more dilution of classes by adding another class and making the day longer. Which class are we going to delete to add this new class.
:argue
Maybe the Novice shifter becomes the Stock Moto Class :idn:
Just a thought.
It seems there are many who would like to run a shifter if it could be done at a similar cost to TaG.
Just looking for ways to help facilitate this need. :cheers:Here’s some additional “food for thought:” The 2005 proposed SKUSA Stock Moto rules. I’ve indicated where I think some changes ought to be made in blue.
1. Motors: 1999 or newer CR or YZ 125
2. Tires: Bridgestone YHC (Should consider a change here….there are better and less expensive alternatives available)
3. Combustion chamber volume CCV: 11.0cc
4. Porting: Porting is not allowed. Adding or deleting ports or re-sleeving is prohibited, and also re-nikasil is prohibited (I think we should allow re-plating – if you stick a piston, why make the racer buy a new cylinder?) Cylinder must remain OEM, with the exception to the stock power valves may be removed and aftermarket plugs used, but with no filling, welding, or modifying the cylinder.
5. Crank, Rod, and Flywheel: Must remain OEM, with no modifications allowed. The two main bearings, big end bearing and small end bearing are to be OEM. Piston and Ring must also remain OEM parts (I think we should allow an aftermarket piston as long as it retains the OEM profile — for reliability). Ignition timing must be stock, and the flywheel key must be in place. NO static advance allowed.
6. Transmission: Transmission is OEM, NO modifications allowed, except aftermarket springs, discs, and plates may be used. You may not delete any plates.
7. Exterior Case Modifications: Cases must remain OEM, NO modifications allowed. The kick starter may be removed, with no modifications. Plug allowed. (We should consider allowing trimming the kick starter boss and allowing the straightened manifold — simply because this rule would eliminate over 90% of the previously modified motors).
8. Exhaust System: Stock moto will use a spec pipe, (RLV) Honda: #6800, Yamaha #6804 (We could choose whatever pipe / silencer we want).
9. Ignition CDI: OEM ignition will be used, with NO modifications. Race officials or the Technical Director has the right to make any competitor swap ignitions prior to going out on the race track. If competitor does not comply, a DQ will result with no exceptions to this rule and cannot be protested. No static ignition advance allowed.
10. Gaskets, bearings and seals: OEM only, NO modifications or aftermarket parts allowed.
11. Carburetors: The only approved carb is the PWK, with the max size of 38.6mm. NO pump around systems allowed. (We might want to re-think the carb rule and allow others as long as they make the 38.6mm size restriction.)
12. Reeds and Reed Block, and manifold: Reeds and Reed block, and manifold must be OEM only. With no modifications (again we might want to think about allowing straight manifolds taking into consideration the existing supply of motors).
13. Weight: 385 lbs (I think that this is reasonable and would be fine for more than 95% of the participants).
14. Airbox: SKUSA requires them for all shifters…We could continue as we do today and make it a local option, or bite the bullet and mandate for all races.
I think that given the above rules, the motors would be extremely reliable, much less costly (Not having run a TAG, I don’t know if it would comparable, but much less than today), and far more forgiving to drive compared to today’s highly modified grenades. I would also open the class to ALL drivers — not limit it to novices.
Let the discussions begin!
Well, I guess now is a good time to let the cat out of the bag.
(And since I’ve been told it’s OK to talk about it, it’s for real)The EasyKart 125 Shifter is being tested in Italy.
Due to be released in the US for the 2005 season.This will be a true SPEC SHIFTER :sun:
I have no plans to move out of TaG at the moment, but would like to move to a shifter class in the next few years. There is just something about rowing thru gears that is damn fun… 8)
I would definetly like to see some sort of stock/spec class to keep costs down. Its just rediculous to see some of the bills that modified ICC/moto users are paying for maintinenece. A stock moto class seems like the way to go. Tons of parts and from what I’ve heard, much cheaper to obtain than ICC parts, since there are so many moto engines around.
I’m just hoping for a 4stroke, fuel injected spec class in the future. I’m not a big fan of engine “tinkering”…. 👿
I’m just hoping for a 4stroke, fuel injected spec class in the future. I’m not a big fan of engine “tinkering”….
8)
Tinkering is what its all about!! 🙄 :rotate::cheers:
@Ben Schermerhorn wrote:
I’m just hoping for a 4stroke, fuel injected spec class in the future. I’m not a big fan of engine “tinkering”….
8)
Tinkering is what its all about!! 🙄 :rotate::cheers:
Some people love to tinker with this and that but i’m personally a fan of seat time. I’d rather show up and race. Maybe play with suspension/chassis settings but I can’t stand the amount of work that carburated 2-stokes take to run at their full potential. I’d rather have a computer (fuel injection) take care of the fueling.
I obviously dont expect it anytime soon but I can dream….. :idn:
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